Kickas.org Forums Treatments, Drugs and Alternatives NSD and diet-related; My New Rheumy

i finally have a new rheumatologist in town, one who i'm pretty convinced will treat me and try different things until i am feeling better.

the interesting thing is that my new naturpath, my new chiro, and now this new rheumy are all on the same wavelength, all have the same philosophies, and totally different than other doctors i have been to.

so, i am really curious how many of you have a rheumatologist who believes in the spondy / leaky gut theory and treating it with diet, probiotics, supplements, other natural means if possible, vs western medications?


the new rheumy says:

1. i don't believe autoimmune diseases are (just) genetic. i believe something causes them (meaning environmental i think, meaning infection, gut microflora, food allergens, leaky gut, that sort of thing).

2. well something has to be causing the flares (again meaning the kinds of things above).

3. i believe all spondyloarthropathies start in the gut.

i can see this in me. i started with IBS, then gastritis 5-6 years before i started with the arthritis. and i have noticed arthritis flares are usually proceeded by very noticeable IBS (either loose undigested bowel movements or severe unexplainable constipation both accompanied by mucus (often a sign of inflammation).

4. have you tried a no starch or low starch diet? it really helps some people.

i told him my short trial with NSD, that i've been on LSD for several years now, but was switching to paleo. i think i must be one of those people that would have to be very strict NSD for along time to see any effect, as i know i was doing LSD well since it turned my HDLs and triglycerides totally around for the good and lowered my blood sugar out of the prediabetic range. but didn't seem to prevent my flares. so the LSD is definitely not enough for me, so time to go deeper.

5. talked about good bacteria / bad bacteria.

starting probiotics.
the naturpath had me do a stool sample test kit. everything appeared normal except i have no lactobacilli and do have other potentially disease causing unidentified bacillus species. i've already posted "where have all the lactobacilli gone" and got some excellent responses. i was just surprised since i was eating stoneyfield yogurt every day. but if the bad bacteria are out competing the good bacteria, then i guess it all makes sense.

6. talked to me about leaky gut and food allergens.

the naturpath also gave me a food allergen blood test kit. i had very high antibody readings to casein and milk/dairy and low antibody readings to eggs. thus staying away from both now.

7. talked supplements.

he saw i was starting with the fish oil again. though it didn't seem to help last time, i think its worth another go round.

he suggested coQ. not for inflammation, but for the muscle spasms and tight muscles. i don't know if it was pure coincidence or not, but my calves were so sore the last two days from being on my feet in DC last week. took coQ before bed and calves all better! feet still a bit inflamed, but no more sore calves.

he saw i was now taking magnesium and was encouraged that it was not only making my bowels more regular, but alleviating the AM calf cramps and anytime foot cramps.

he talked to me about vit C. i know donette is a strong proponent of vit C. he wanted me to get a blood test first, see if its low, but i think that will be the next thing to start.

8. he said i could start SSZ if i wanted to, but recommended i continue on this more natural path first. follow it through.

he thought out of everything, SSZ made some sense since it contains a sulfa antibiotic.

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so, he has me starting probiotics, coQ, and fish oil. i'm trying to eliminate all starch again, since LSD isn't enough. we may start vit C. and if that all doesn't do it, then we'll reevaluate.

we talked briefly about the LDN but he wasn't familiar with it. but seems open minded enough that with the papers, i may be able to open him up to the idea. my last rheumy, as much as he didn't really help me much, after me convincing him of LDNs value, he tried it with several other patients.

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he did give me a sample of dichlofenac (plus stomach protecting prostaglandin) if i decided that i wanted to try it. the rationale is that the flector patch is helping my SI joint immensely. but i do know that nsaids contribute to leaky gut and if i want to heal my gut, i need to not take the nsaids. for me a pretty easy choice as they either work but with intolerable side effects, or no side effects but don't work.

Dr P (my doctor) and Dr S are supposed to be the best rheumatologists in town according to all my doctors. i'm pleased with his approach to things, even if i wasn't expecting it. i've been trying to do this naturally for a long time, maybe with his (and the naturpath's and chiro's) help, maybe this time i can.

Wow, sounds like you have a really cool doc! That's great. Here's to hope that you feel lots better, Sue!

well, this is a good thing, hope you will do better on NSD

SUE! sounds like u found the doc a lot of us r looking for. good for u!!! im really excited to see your path unfold from here and hope u keep us posted on how this is going.


thanks for sharing.

Congrats on sticking it out until you found a medical team like that.

I've got a sensible GP, but to answer your specific question, no, my rheumatologist does not show any interest in exploring the effects of diet or supplements. Even though one of the residents doing research under his guidance did a study finding gut inflammation in a strong majority of AS subjects not showing gut symptoms.

thanks all for the replies. i thought this was rare for a rheumatologist to not only support, but advocate for the leaky gut / infection theory. i get the impression he uses western medicine drugs as well if needed, but tries to avoid that route if possible.

funny, i wasn't looking for this type of doctors. just turned out that these were the ones who ended up giving me the most help.

i still have a more traditional gastroenterologist, endocrinologist, etc who are also great. but it was the rheumatologist i needed the most and the one that took the longest to find.

he also has an eye on my gallbladder polyp. small so the other doctors don't think its a problem, but he wonders if it might be causing low grade infection. my white count is always borderline high, sometimes just above, sometimes just below, but always something that doctors take note of.

likewise, he took a close look at my gums to see if gum disease might be causing my systemic inflammation, but i have pretty healthy gums.

i really think for me it is the gut. just wish the NSD worked faster / easier for me, but dedicated to trying to give the diet (and the new supplements) a good go at it. will really work at "healing the gut".

My *current* rheumatologist supports the leaky gut theory and that's why I swapped from the previous 2 who disappointed me in their "take this drug and see me in 6 months" attitude. No interest in exploring *any* whys or wherefors...

Then again, I think he is a rare breed - given that he is another Dr Ebringer (the Younger) - he has many years of clinical experience at the London Middlesex Hospital.

Biggest question is: what am I going to do when he wants to retire???

from all the papers i have been coming across lately in my own field (microbial biochemistry), i think this theory is slowly catching on.

from my own experience, i think currently rheumies that think this way are in the minority, but i predict that it will be a more common approach in the future, since this seems to be a major research focus right now. microbial ecology of the gut and its relationship to disease is very hot right now and i think it will only continue to grow as a field of research.

good to see someone else with this kind of rheumy.

Yah Sue, how exciting. Have you found a probiotic your happy with? So far the only one that I feel hasn't made me feel a little worse is Pearls by enzymatic (?), but so many of em make so many claims about actually working, frustrating. Really not ready to plunk down cash on healthy trinity.
Was glutamine ever mentioned to take? It supposedly helps with gut healing?
thx marycay

have been reading (here) about glutamine. have it on my "to consider in the future" list. i don't want to throw the kitchen sink at it, then wonder either what is working or what is causing problems, depending on what happens. normally its just one thing at a time. this time started fish oil, coQ, and probiotics. if i do well, will continue and increase the fish oil. if i start doing worse (either arthritis or more likely GI symptoms) will stop all, wait til i'm back to "normal" again, and then just add back each one, one thing at a time to discover the culprit. just started all three this weekend, so we'll see what happens, so far, so good, no major issues.

as for the probiotics. taking what the naturpath recommended. we'll see how it goes. if for some reason i decide to change, will look here for guidance. the one i'm taking is supposed to be good for healing gut inflammation, can't remember its name, i'll look it up and report back?

reading about gut healing so i can do all i can to work on it. like everyone else here.