Kickas.org Forums Treatments, Drugs and Alternatives NSD and diet-related; Supplements

Hi guys
Ive just recently stumbled upon this website, its awesome! I am 28 and was diagnosed with AS at the start of this year, after 10+ yrs of back pain. My naturopath recommended the LSD, but at the same time put me on the isotonix range of supplements (magnesium, opc 3, vitamin c, digestive enzymes and joint support). These all contain sugars, hydrolysed starch and maltodextrin. She claims that they are small enough quantities to be easily digested and wont be an issue, and that they are an important ingredient for aiding absorption. Does any one have an opinion on this, and has anyone taken the isotonix range of supplements? they have a lot of positive reviews, in particular opc-3, which my naturopath believes is crucial for auto immune disease patients as it helps regulate the immune system.

Thanks 😀

I removed all my supplements that contained any starch, including sugars, hydrolysed starch and maltodextrin - starch is starch and while some people may not react to small amounts, some do and it may seem like the diet isn't working.

WELCOME, Josh300788:

Your naturopath seems aware of the cause of AS enough to suggest LSD and if You are doing only LSD and not NSD, You are already getting a relatively large amount of starches.

It might be a good experiment to first cooperate with her and see how things go before switching to much more strict NSD, if necessary. Another couple of months might be worth the effort.

We are sometimes at cross-purposes in both trying to lower our starch consumption and also trying to heal the gut. Sometimes the most important part is gut-healing, even secondary to very strict NSD. It could be useful and instructive to both Yourself and the good physician if You first cooperated and then--if and when necessary--went onto strict diet and observe the differences.

We are all continually experimenting and learn from each other.

Thank You, for joining and I know You will soon enjoy renewed

HEALTH,
John

Thanks guys.

John - my naturopath believes i have a candida overgrowth and wants to focus on that first (i was on antibiotics for many yrs and had a bad diet which she believes has caused my gut issues).My plan was to do what you said, heal my gut first then go to a NSD. My naturopath doesnt agree with this, she believes a small amount of starch is essential for a healthy gut. She is much more concerned about sugar, which makes it hard for me as i am following a NSD but cant have fruit or anything that contains sugar, which includes a lot of starch free recipes. I am essentially on a NSD diet at the moment, with the exception of supplements, carrots and almonds (apparently the skin is starchy?).
Thanks again for the replies.

Hi Josh,

I heard something similar from my ND. Resistant starch is the darling of the natural health community at the moment, with evidence that undigestible starches are important for a healthy colon, and in particular for the production of butyrate by gut bacteria. A little over a year ago, after eating a fairly low carb paleo diet (no grains, no dairy) for some time, I was convinced by the research and deliberately started eating more resistant starch: plantain, unripe bananas, sweet potatoes, tiger nuts, etc.

My partner, who also ate the same things, had a magnificent improvement in his sleep, his body temperature and his digestion - he's a model example of the benefits, and he continues to eat that way. Meanwhile, I started to sleep better, but had no other improvements. And about 6 months later I got stiff all over and developed a new debilitating pain in my fingers that I had never had before (it's what eventually led me to KickAS).

Since going NSD my pain has improved tremendously - not just my fingers but my back, my neck, my knees, my skin, my mood. All of this is to say that while I agree in principle with NDs (and the science) on the health benefits of starch, I'm not convinced it was beneficial for me. Ultimately my ND has been supportive of NSD - hard to argue with visible results!

Gut health is a different issue, however, and I do worry about the long term effect of starch avoidance on the health of my colon. My hope is that through strict NSD and gut healing I will be able to tolerate more starches again some day.

Hi Josh,

I think naturopaths have a tendency to view everyone as being fundamentally the same, so that they often downplay meat and push you more toward a vegetarian diet. It is therefore surprising that your naturopath would recommend LSD.

I don't mean to promote this author, but I have been reading a book entitled 'Primal Fat Burner', the author Nora Gedgaugas.
This book promotes a ketogenic diet, the focus being to burn fat, lesser amounts of protein, and eat virtually no carbs, excepting green leafy vegetables, avocados and small quantities of berries. This diet will address the great disasters of our age - obesity, diabetes and heart disease; diseases which have exploded with the rise of low fat foods (high carb, low prot).

Essentially it is a form of the NSD. She points out that many vitamins (A, D, E) are fat soluble and that eating grass fed meats, wild caught fish, free range eggs and avoiding starchy root vegetables is our natural (evolutionary) state.

There's probably plenty of stuff on ketogenic diets on the net - worth investigating.

Regards David P.

It is as if eating meat is some sort of sin and they want us all to be vegetarian.

Hey, Josh300788:


Regret the anti-candidiasis diet is much more difficult than NSD because it excludes sugars and starches. With AS, there is no such thing as a "healthy" starch.

Almond skins do provoke a reaction in many of us since they do contain some starch.

The natural way to treat the fungal overgrowth usually includes colloidal silver, garlic, caprylic acid (EFA), and something that treats both AS and candidiasis--oregano oil. I use the NOW brand enteric-coated capsules, but they must be taken with food. Good to follow up with a probiotic yoghurt like Brown Cow or Stonyfield Farms--not too much but 2oz can help a lot.

Candidiasis causes leaky gut, so treating this is very important. Some of our members have told me they tried the natural way, but had to resort to the antifungal medications.

The most important supplements are EVOliveOil--8-10 teaspoonfuls daily, lysine, vitC, vitE, niacinamide in some larger (500mg) quantity, chelated zinc and copper, and vitD (not least). Calcium and magnesium are also very important. If You still have residual inflammation, it is good to take borage seed oil 6-8 1000mg capsules before retiring.

Raw carrots never bothered me, but when cooked they did cause a lot of trouble.

Taking down the fungus is an important first step. Have You done the "spittle test?"

HEALTH,
John

Agree completely that NDs tend towards a "one size fits all" view of nutrition. To be fair, while research has challenged the demonization of meat, there is some evidence that plant-based diets favour longevity and other positive health outcomes. Certainly the Blue Zone communities - those regions around the world noted for their good health and long lives - tend to be vegetarian/infrequent meat eaters, so I do think there's something to it. But obviously tailoring is required - a diabetic's needs vs. someone with AS vs. someone with IBS, etc. are nuances NDs don't always appreciate.

I had to shop around a bit for a naturopath who wasn't rigid in their nutritional views. And I didn't find any here with experience with NSD and AS. At least my ND was open to it.


Interesting! I agree completely that fat soluble vitamins are overlooked in our low-fat obsessed world. Over the last few years my teeth have improved immeasurably since adopting a higher fat diet and taking care of my A,D,E and K vitamins. However, her argument about evolutionary eating I'm somewhat skeptical about. My own reading suggests that plant-based food and starchy vegetables in particular are believed to have been central to the ancestral diet. And in modern times, subsistence cultures and even remaining hunter/gatherers - which don't suffer from the diseases of civilization - tend to primarily eat plant-based diets. But that's not to say a fat/meat-based diet can't also be healthy and sustainable.

I guess we'll find out for ourselves! As you rightly point out, her diet is pretty much the NSD. We'll get to see first hand whether we manage to avoid obesity, diabetes and heart disease...

One other thing you constantly hear, is people with gut issues being told by Naturopaths that they have an overgrowth of Candida.
The patient has to virtually take this advice on faith, but where is the proof.
Down the microscope - viewing the poo (this is a job that should be profiled on "Dirty Jobs"), it's rarely obvious. Many 'normal' people have yeast in their poo!!