Kickas.org Forums Ankylosing Spondylitis General Discussion #1 AS Web Support Group Is depression/anxiety a symptom of AS?

Yikes, panic setting in, I have to do sound effects for next "30 Rock" episode by tomorrow night!

Ow, ow, ow..

Thanks James! Please keep us all updated on the status of your surgeries and treatment plan. I'm trying to finish a really hard history class right now, so I'm not on as much lately. Peace

Along these lines, do NOT attempt to do the Combat Side Stroke just because there is someone (30 years younger!) else in the pool who is doing it. UFF!

Yes dear Mr. Dow-ster, you are right, it is worth investigating to learn every trick!

I can't say that I am very good at relaxing. Muscle tightness became a norm for me, that natural reaction of bracing against pain, tensing up, happens long before I hit a 7 and is a protective instinct that can sometimes help and other times be very detrimental. I don't reach any concious fear until well past 7, and rarely panic (not until 8+) but by then you're pretty desperate to calm things, but it helps more when you start earlier, like 6. And it depends on the pain. An old pain at 7 is easy but a new area hitting 4 is harder to push out mentally.

Theoretically, I suppose I would have been full of neural superhighways by year 5 since the chronic nature of pain (without periods of relief) would have burned those paths regardless of being at a 4-7-2 or 5. I'm not sure though, because I can tolerate pain, like the kind that stepping on a nail would produce, better than most, with no fear and no physiological reaction outside of the norm. Learning how to prevent pain from escalating is a mental as well as a physical battle and I regret that I didn't have the tools, or KA, back when I was stumbling through it, and had to learn my tricks just by experience. Can we read about it and thus get 'there' any faster? Maybe, yes!

Yep, fear plays a role. Now, whenever I feel in the least bit fearful, (like, ack - is my stupid ribcage fusing now?!) I need only think of, or chat with Alan and I am reassured that I'll be ok. It doesn't kill us, it only makes us stronger! Cripes, I think that I've gotten off-topic! lol

No, stress is not good and relaxation does help. And, btw, iritis seems directly tied (to me) with that fight-flight adrenaline response. Take extra care when cognisant of being under stress and get extra sleep. All tricks help. If I knew then, what I know now, I would have been more open to taking narcotics and I would have taken the odd day off from work when pain was at the high end of the scale, instead of pushing myself so hard. I am much kinder to me now and I am still learning too.

Hugs!

You clearly do understand what I am talking about!

Neural superhighways, being around people that help us be calm, asking yourself how much of what you may feel is purely physical (stepping on a nail) and how much our brain and nervous system may be contributing and feeding the fire (panic mode)

Here's another set of thoughts I keep having:

Although it makes sense, to avoid stressful triggers, develop relaxation techniques etc, to keep us from adding to the cycle

But how about another angle, rather than avoid them, I wonder if we can condition ourselves to not respond in the way that we do to trigger events? Have it both ways?

Like rather than avoid a scary movie, or even fun but exciting things like a rollercoaster ride, a video game, do these things anyway, make observations about what we experience, and develop techniques to avoid going into fight-or-flight mode?

Recently, I returned to active work, very stressful indeed, and as expected, my pain levels went up. Not so much from physically doing anything, just the anxiety and anticipation of all the things that could go wrong...

(Once I got back to work, remembered how to do it again, confidence returned, I relaxed, and hey, whattyaknow, I felt better!)

But I also went to a concert, sat in the very front row, and I was certainly very excited about it, enjoyed it very much. But that too, also really increased my pain.

So I learned something from this, that it may be ANY excited state, with all cylinders firing, that increases heart rate, muscle tension, and maintains the neural superhighway.

So for me, my quest is to find a way to do BOTH, live a full active lifestyle, not avoid doing things I need or want to do, but continue to find ways to keep my nervous system from over-responding when I don't want it to!

Of course, this wouldn't be the kind of thing that could get "fixed" overnight, took many years to get to my current state, so even if I am successful at lowering my response to stressful triggers, by changing the thought patterns and learning new tunes, it would for sure take considerable time to tear down the existing neural superhighway

But another fact that the book mentions gives hope. That the cells receptors that receive pain signals replicate every three days, and so the ones that we have three days from now will be another new chance to begin..

This is definitely my goal, though I have had to redefine "full active" in the past couple of years.

For instance, I practice tai chi and swim now instead of hiking 6-10 miles with my hiking group. I've met lots of new inspiring people at the pool and have slowly gotten over the resentment against my joints.

Foam earplugs work great for loud situations and movies, because they filter out the extreme high frequencies but let you hear the middle and low tones.

And stretching THE MINUTE I notice I'm feeling pain helps so much. I don't even have to do the whole routine, just a couple of simple stretches and presto. Much better.

I also find that taking a deep, relaxing breathe the moment I notice tension in an area helps. I love Tai Chi, by the way. The combination of movement and meditation is invaluable. Pilates does the same thing for me.

Breathing, relaxing, meditation, stretching, focus on a specific area (ie. the tailbone in pilates, the quality of the movement in Tai Chi), all help.

I am always on the same quest of living a full, active lifestyle. It's not easy and many times I just make it happen and deal with the consequences later. Perhaps it's not the smartest way to deal with it, but sometimes it's the only way everything will get done. And I'm far too pig-headed to accept limitations. When my rheumy realized this about me, he looked at me, shook his head and said the two dreaded words, "Pace yourself."

So, I try to pace myself, space out my shows, try to keep relaxation techniques foremost, and rest when I need to. There are days, like yesterday, when that is flatly impossible. I didn't realize how very important that one hour at home between work and rehearsal is until yesterday, when my personal responsibilities, work schedule and rehearsal schedule colided. Had to move my shift from 8:30-4:30 to 10:00-6:00 due to personal responsibilities, rehearsal starts at 7:00 and I didn't get my one hour of rest between work and rehearsal. My sweetie picked me up at work at 6:00, I ate dinner from tupperware he brought me and changed into jeans in the car, dropped him at the house and arrived at rehearsal with only 5 minutes to spare. I was flat-out scattered (read "practically useless as a director") at rehearsal and came home in really rough shape at 10:15 last night. Didn't help that my period started yesterday and the resultant increase in lower back pain wasn't fun. I knew I needed a half hour of downtime at the very least and couldn't get it. Not even 5 minutes. Deep breathing helped only briefly, and you cannot do relaxation or meditation techniques when your cast, producer, wardrobe mistress and stage manager all want your attention at the same time.

Luckily, fiascos like yesterday are few and far between (and CERTAINLY will not be happening on this show again). Usually, I manage to maintain a balance of rest/relaxation and everything else. Of course, usually, 'everything else' doesn't land on top of me in one 24 hour period. Thank goodness today is Enbrel day.

Warm hugs,

My sister used to call me the Great and Powerful OZ.

This self pacing is a humbling experience for me, and it has been a good process. I find that the trick is to do less without feeling less than I was in the past.

I agree 100% about the AS with depression and anxiety, at 27 Ive had my share of both. I am a generally a happy person and when physically feeling well have a lot of energy. Life stress on top of school and not feeling well at one point made me ponder if life was worth it.
I tried lexapro but it made me really sick (and as a result more depressed) I don't feel up to trying something new. SO for now I know when to get help if I need it, exercise (I'm a swimmer too!), and try to maintain the attitude that it is an odd blessing in disguise, because it is a beautiful thing to not take anything for granted and to find the strength to overcome.
I am in my pediatric rotation right now working with patients that are very ill waiting for new hearts, livers, and bowels and they are such an inspiration to me, even those hooked up to external heart machines, smile, laugh, and want to play with you, their courage is infectious, they are beautiful.
While at times it is hard for me to maintain a sunshiny disposition, I have decided I might have AS but it's not going to have me!!!

that sounds like what happens to me regarding migraines. its not actually the day of stress itself, but the coming down off of stress that does it for me, that's one of the ways i know its a migraine and not stress headache. and good stress will often produce an infinitely more superb migraine than bad stress. when i was younger, i'd get them more often, easier, from lesser amounts of stress. i've gotten pretty good at getting rid of them once i have them, but still am often surprised when i wake with one and then have to think, "oh yes, yesterday was an emotional day. no wonder i have a migraine." its been probably 40 years and i'm still working on how to have highs and lows and not the migraines. something happens with my brain chemistry, but still haven't quite figured it all out. but have learned that once i have one, not only do i need to do all the physical things to overcome it: like eating, tylenol, caffeine, quiet, low lighting, but also have to consciously change my thought patterns. its a really hard thing to explain, but i can always feel when i'm making it better or when i'm once again making it worse.

i remember you sharing the title of a book with me, "A Headache in the Pelvis". wonder if while my migraine responses to stress, both good and bad, are pain in my head, if your response is this response that you describe.

i've had 40 years to try to come to terms with it, and while i can work with it once i have it, still am always surprised when it hits me, so still work to do in that department. but they are fewer and further between and it does take more stress to trigger them, so i must be learning something subconsciously, even if i don't quite know what it is.

my arthritis is much newer, so at a much earlier point of that journey, but hoping that my migraine experience will help me in this journey as well.